Cuba in a month today! Any tips?... [Archive]

cbob

26-09-2009, 03:17 AM

I am looking for...

Good places to sit and chill out
Because of the climate, you can sit out everywhere but you'll only be able to really chill in your air-conned hotel.
In Havana: sit out and be cool at the Hotel Nacional. On the teraza. With a Mojito. There is a great Casa del Habano there too.
I like the brew pub in Plaza Vieja too,

If you want to sit "in", I'd find the Bacardi building. One of the nicer little bars in Havana and not in many guidebooks (nudge, nudge, wink, wink)

Good live music bars
The Jazz Cafe and Gato Tuerto in Havana can be good but busy. If you want to experience "local" music and dance, search out the Casa de la Musica in Miramar. It's better than the one downtown.

Swimming pool to loll about in and next to - Hotel Parque is the first stop and it has a great looking pool on the roof
The Parque central does have a great pool and great view. It also has a nice walk-in humidor on the mezzanine. The Nacional also has a nice pool and it's close to the teraza.

Great comfortable places to stop, loll and smoke fresh and great stogies
Everywhere! Do a tour of all the better shops and stop for a smoke/drink in each. Great lounges in Partagas, Melia Cohiba, Melia Havana, C. del Habano 5y16, Conde de Villanueva...

To be in the proximity of good looking women without my beloved noticing too much
You won't have to look for beauties-they will find you, especially if you are wearing a YUMA hat. If one of them smiles at you and scratches at her cheek just below her eye (as if wiping a tear) tell your beloved to belt her one.

Numbing alcoholic drinks
Es Cuba! Your mind can be numbed at amazingly cheap prices but stick to bars that serve tourists. Worst Mojios are at the Bodeguita (famous for its Mojitos) but great ones can be had at Dos Hermanos, Havana Club and Nacional. Buy a bottle of Anejo 7yo for those "nightcaps".

Plenty of fresh fruits
That can be hit or miss. Should be OK now but food supplies in Cuba are still recovering from last fall's hurricanes. get a few "local" pesos (CUP or moneda nacional) and go to an agromercado.

Great beach with plenty of shade
Not near Havana. The Playas del Este are the local beaches and are nice but for great beaches you have to go to Varadero or points east.

.

Robusto

26-09-2009, 06:24 AM

Great pointers! Much appreciated, my friend.

How about bus travel, anyone? Reservations.

As a Brit, I like to book things several light years ahead.
I'm going to have to drop that one!

We're heading towards Trinidad for homestays and beaches.

I don't want to be forced into dancing. I'm crap at it.
I'll look like a porker from Frankfurt, you know.

cj121

26-09-2009, 07:39 AM

Our only experience of buses were the more touristy coaches that took us from Havana back to Varedero Bryan, about 25 CUC each. From memory they do the rounds to and from hotels around major cities and the resorts. We booked it 'independently' from the Hotel Nationale, Havana.

You might want to check out Viazul (it gives you a hard on, on coaches:rolleyes:) Only pulling your doo-dah. Note the site doesn't book tickets though. And yes internet is available in most hotels. We got talking to a young man in Havana (medically trained, but operating a horse and trap for tourists) who used the net to communicate and keep abreast of things. I don't think it's as subversive as portrayed widely, but the cost of such keeps usage for many to a minimum.

BUSES (http://www.habanasol.com/cuba/buses.htm)

Robusto

26-09-2009, 04:12 PM

The bus timetable is very useful for a nice bit of ard on thinking. Thanks, Chris. :biggrin1:

cj121

26-09-2009, 09:55 PM

The bus timetable is very useful for a nice bit of ard on thinking. Thanks, Chris. :biggrin1:

Wah, wah wah:biggrin1:

Mind you, I started it!

I've kept bleating on here and there about the Hotel Nationale on the forum, but you must get there Bryan. A mojito out back whist the sunsets is very nice. And there's a nice eatery out back too.

cbob

28-09-2009, 02:45 AM

You can go directly through Viazul:

http://www.viazul.com/asp/reserva/Default.aspx

I use this site to reserve and pre-pay all my bus travel. Havana-Varadero is only $10 CUC ( about $11 USD) either way and the coaches are new.

.

Robusto

28-09-2009, 05:58 AM

Absolutely fantastic! :smoke:
Thank you.

(I think someone I know told me you would be the fountain you are. Got to be the same guy...).

moidoid

30-09-2009, 11:55 PM

What are you thinking of bringing back Robusto?

sam12

12-10-2009, 01:18 PM

I really want to know more about this trip.It seems to be very excited trip carrying toothpaste and shampoo to have an discount..

Robusto

14-10-2009, 09:33 PM

Plugs, sockets, electricity.

Any Cuba vet Brit know if one of those multi-plugs from Boots, Tesco, etc, will be OK for electric razors and joy balls in Havana and beyond, please?

PoohBore

14-10-2009, 09:43 PM

it worked fine for me. My hotel also had the shaver socket in the bathroom.

cbob

15-10-2009, 02:57 AM

Mostly standard 2-pin "continental" sockets.

220 volts

.

tupacboy

15-10-2009, 03:32 AM

wow... looking at that marty's list...

cigars are not cheaper there... kinda surprising to me..

PoohBore

15-10-2009, 05:13 AM

a big factor is the exchange rate. In may this year my parents got 1.25 cuc to the £ its now around 1.5 i got 2 years ago 1.72

cj121

15-10-2009, 05:23 AM

Mostly standard 2-pin "continental" sockets.

220 volts

.

As Cbob says, but some of the two pin sockets are either a tad wider or narrower depending on what adaptor you have. When out buying Bryan, check out the variations and buy both if available.

Robusto

15-10-2009, 06:20 AM

Thank you, men.

PoohBore

15-10-2009, 07:00 AM

happy to help, looking forward to your travel report - especially on the cigar shops!.

whisky77

15-10-2009, 11:57 AM

Plugs, sockets, electricity.

Any Cuba vet Brit know if one of those multi-plugs from Boots, Tesco, etc, will be OK for electric razors and joy balls in Havana and beyond, please?

Should have no probs at all Bryan, i took my multi plug to charge my Ipod, and there were no problems at all............while there was electricity that is.:rolleyes:

The power cuts only add to the enjoyment.Remember that your credit cards are no good in the majority of the country and UK sterling currency is the thing to have lots of.

Couple of ATM machines in Havana if you get stuck for cash(especially useful after visiting the Partagas factory).:eek:

Remember, it`s not just a holiday, it`s a MFing adventure!:p

PoohBore

15-10-2009, 12:03 PM

does the partagas factory accept cards?

whisky77

15-10-2009, 02:00 PM

does the partagas factory accept cards?

Although it seemed the most "touristy" of factories, I still do not remember them having that facility.

There are very few places where you can use any cards.:rolleyes:

whisky77

15-10-2009, 02:04 PM

I really want to know more about this trip.It seems to be very excited trip carrying toothpaste and shampoo to have an discount..

I think you have got the wrong end of the stick Sam.You give these things away for free due to the fact that the people have nothing.

The only thing you will not get a discount on is a smile as a thank you.

tupacboy

15-10-2009, 05:38 PM

a big factor is the exchange rate. In may this year my parents got 1.25 cuc to the £ its now around 1.5 i got 2 years ago 1.72

Ic ic... but i figured with it being local, and no import tax etc.. it would be way cheaper... just surprising that it was higher

moidoid

15-10-2009, 07:14 PM

wow... looking at that marty's list...

cigars are not cheaper there... kinda surprising to me..

Where are you getting them cheaper Tupac? My usual dealers can't beat the Cuban prices.

tupacboy

15-10-2009, 08:57 PM

not sure if you get different pricing because of you being in the UK... but our sponser here is cheaper...

Robusto

16-10-2009, 12:22 AM

I heard today that apart from pens, toothpaste, soap... a good thing to take and use as a tip is small packets of Paracetamol. I'll be popping to Supadrug at some point this week!

PoohBore

16-10-2009, 04:54 AM

i forgot to mention that the official government uniforms for cuba were designed by benny hill. I saw a nurse in white stileto's, fish nets and a dress 2 sizes to small. Enjoy that thought-.

whisky77

16-10-2009, 08:50 AM

i forgot to mention that the official government uniforms for cuba were designed by benny hill. I saw a nurse in white stileto's, fish nets and a dress 2 sizes to small. Enjoy that thought-.

LOL.I saw a couple of female security gaurds who obviously went to the same shop.
They were wearing five inch heels as well, which I thought would be handy when trying to chase the criminals.:biggrin1:

stephan

16-10-2009, 09:21 AM

My trip to Cuba was over ten years ago but I remember...

Every cigar I smoked tasting better than anywhere else. The ambience just made them taste better!

Staying in a Casa Particulares. Much more real than any hotel! Huge rooms - colonial splendour! I also felt connected by staying with and speaking with 'my' Cuban family every day.

Copelia in Havana. It's great and I'd recommend getting there at an off peak time. Mid afternoon the queues can be long. It's a 50s ice cream parlour, architecturally interesting and favoured by locals more than tourists.

Getting lots of smiles and good mornings on my early morning jogs. I find it's one of the best ways of getting a feel for a new place.

Music everywhere! Bars with two customers had a five man band!

Staying away from touristy spots and then noticing the stark contrast when going to a tourist show. It does not seem like the same island.

Terrible food when eating out. At 'home' food was great (cooked by the people we were staying with), but every restaurant had tasteless rubbery food. I must have had ten lobsters in my quest for some taste and still no luck.

I wonder how much has changed and I will be interested to hear from you when you return.

PoohBore

16-10-2009, 09:22 AM

at the hotel i stayed in when the waitress brought drink to you she flashed stocking tops every time she leaned forward to put them on the table!

Stevieboy

16-10-2009, 09:06 PM

cbob

19-10-2009, 02:33 AM

Although it seemed the most "touristy" of factories, I still do not remember them having that facility.

There are very few places where you can use any cards.:rolleyes:

I've been using my VISA and MC all over in Cuba for many years. I always use it at Partagas, even for things like events and I buy all my cigars and bus travel with my card. Any cigar store you would patronize will accept cards.

The only cards that are NOT accepted are ones from US banks and you should check to be sure because even here in Canada, some of our cards are actually on US based banks (CitiBank, some Master Cards).
"American Express"? :p It goes without saying.

There are also no ATM machines that take "bank" cards (account cards). You can use your credit card to get cash advances from banks and the few ATMs in Havana but certainly NO debit cards are accepted.

.

cbob

19-10-2009, 02:52 AM

My trip to Cuba was over ten years ago but I remember...

Every cigar I smoked tasting better than anywhere else. The ambience just made them taste better!

Your opening line holds the key here.

Little is the same as it was in Cuba 10 years ago but I'll admit that you appear to have enjoyed a few of the pleasures that are still a joy in Havana.

If you had a Casa Particular with "colonial splendour" you were indeed lucky but many people still enjoy being out of the "hotel" loop.

Copelia is still a great place to go and it is getting a bit easier to avoid the embarrassing visits of a few years ago when "extraneros" were called into a seperate line and served first while block-long "colas" of locals waited patiently for one of two flavours. Curiously (or maybe not) Habaneros with CUCs prefer to go to Bim Bom where they usually have a big selection.

The food is much better "on a good month" but with the drastic reduction in produce and staples since the last big hurricanes, most places in Havana that don't have access to "tourist" markets have slim fare.
When I spent a month in Havana last November/December many locals were going hungry and if you wanted more than "rations" at your homestay you needed to shop for your host family at the CUC supermercados. Even then some hotels and markets were short of food.
There are many quite good small restaurants in Havana now and even the over-hyped Aljibe in Miramar that gets a write-up in every guide book still has a great "all you can eat" dinner for a low price that has not changed in several years.

.

Robusto

19-10-2009, 06:17 AM

Must print this off this week and pack some Cream Crackers, too.

whisky77

19-10-2009, 01:52 PM

I've been using my VISA and MC all over in Cuba for many years. I always use it at Partagas, even for things like events and I buy all my cigars and bus travel with my card. Any cigar store you would patronize will accept cards.

The only cards that are NOT accepted are ones from US banks and you should check to be sure because even here in Canada, some of our cards are actually on US based banks (CitiBank, some Master Cards).
"American Express"? :p It goes without saying.

There are also no ATM machines that take "bank" cards (account cards). You can use your credit card to get cash advances from banks and the few ATMs in Havana but certainly NO debit cards are accepted.

.

I did make a point of discussing with my bank whether I would be able to use my VISA card and they categorically said it would not be accepted.

I just made a point of taking plenty of cash with me.:smile:

Robusto

19-10-2009, 05:02 PM

That's what I'm thinking of doing, Craig.
Loads of notes.

cohibaIV

19-10-2009, 06:00 PM

That's what I'm thinking of doing, Craig.
Loads of notes.

You can have some more if you get me some cigars...:cool:

PoohBore

19-10-2009, 06:27 PM

The key to the credit card is to take one that is not affiliated with an American Bank. I beleive M&S and the Tesco cards are ok. I had no problem IIRC in the hotel paying for trips etc and i think I was Ok out and about.

cbob

21-10-2009, 02:37 AM

That's the key thing. No American banks. Even hidden ones like Citibank.

Wait! There are 2 key things- no American banks and letting your CC company know when you are going to be using the card away from home so they don't lock your card after your first box of cigars...

3 KEY THINGS!! that you must remember :
- no American banks
- letting your CC company know
- and pre-paying some money into your credit card account

.

cj121

21-10-2009, 06:39 AM

There's a good idea Cbob: getting a prepaid credit card set up. A little homework required to ensure patronage, but safe.

Robusto

24-10-2009, 07:52 AM

Our adventure is about to start. Just wanted to say thanks for the pieces of advice and guidance written here. We will keep this in mind and go our own way. Hope to be able to report back with a smile. Best wishes. Bryan

Deano

24-10-2009, 07:52 AM

Bon Voyage! Can't wait for the pics and write up!

PoohBore

24-10-2009, 09:08 AM

Have a great holiday and I can't wait for the photos and details of your new purchases !

Nuno Sa

24-10-2009, 01:13 PM

Have a nice trip Bryan, i´m looking forward to read all about it, since i also want to go to Cuba with th missus in the near future.

whisky77

25-10-2009, 07:48 AM

Enjoy your adventure Bryan.Hope you have a great time.:41:

moidoid

25-10-2009, 11:24 PM

I'm very jealous. Have a cracking time.

Kubano

27-10-2009, 09:11 PM

Take the Havana tour, and visit the Melia Cohiba were they have a cigar roller, and lots of cigars choose from.

Robusto

02-11-2009, 05:06 PM

Back from the flight from Havana today.

So much to write about.

It will take me a few days to write a personal account and do justice to my thoughts and impressions.

The one thing I would say is that Cuba is an extraordinary place, and for any cigar buddie thinking of going, I would say YOU HAVE TO DO IT.

I would also say that if you are a 'precious' type, be aware that Cuba is 'peeling round the edges'. I didn't realise it is to the extent that it is. (I mean no offence to anyone by that). If you can't hack that - or your partner or family couldn't - then it's not the place for you.

I loved it. So did my wife and lads.

I and will try to explain my thoughts more succinctly when my head doesn't feel like a vibrator rolling around under the seat in front of me off the coast of Newfoundland in a rammed 747.

Yes. I did mean that.
Thank God the batteries are about to cark it.

Deano

02-11-2009, 05:17 PM

He's baccckkkkkkk

jdawg

02-11-2009, 05:43 PM

Welcome back, :cowboyic9:Robusto :cowboyic9:!!!! The place has not been the same without you! I look forward to hearing about your travels.

cohibaIV

02-11-2009, 06:08 PM

Wow, you back already,?? That went fast!!!

MaledettoToscano

02-11-2009, 06:14 PM

Welcome back Robusto, really looking forward to hear how it went in more detail!

Robusto

02-11-2009, 06:14 PM

That's quite a coincidence, mate.

We're just sitting here over the first cups of Tetley saying that we feel as if we've been away for more than two weeks! We did a lot in the time.

Pantomimehorse

02-11-2009, 06:30 PM

looking forward to your report Bry and of course the list of sticks you picked up while out there :41:

nicwing

02-11-2009, 07:08 PM

Hey Bry, welcome back matey.

Looking forward to hearing how it went. Post little and often good buddy, we are hungry for your posts! and you have some catching up to do as you have slipped off the leader board in a sort of Japanese Formula 1 driver stylee...

Stevieboy

02-11-2009, 08:43 PM

Welcome back Big Lad.....report and pictures ASAP please :)

moidoid

02-11-2009, 09:05 PM

Can't wait to hear the battle reports/sticks smoked/sticks brought home/prices etc.

(BTW Nicwing - I'm liking that avatar :biggrin1:)

PoohBore

02-11-2009, 10:09 PM

welcome back, this place has been nuts without you !

Mr_White

02-11-2009, 10:34 PM

I look forward to your tales.

whisky77

03-11-2009, 07:42 AM

Hope you enjoyed your trip Bryan, as much as I enjoyed the time I spent over there in September.

I have been luck enough to travel a few places, and Cuba does leave an impression for sure.

nicwing

03-11-2009, 10:51 AM

Come on Bry man, we need an update...........:mad:

Drewmidorn

03-11-2009, 12:10 PM

Ditto. How as it?

D

Robusto

03-11-2009, 12:54 PM

At work. :(

Doing Cuban music in all Music lessons. :)

Internet being awkward at home.

I'll try and grab half an hour to write something quick on here rather than to write a thesis.

Trouble is there is so much to write about...

Drewmidorn

03-11-2009, 01:02 PM

Hooray, Can't wait to hear all about it!

cj121

03-11-2009, 01:23 PM

Bloody 'ell, welcome back Bryan. Not checked this post as I though you were still away. Hope it went swimmingly mate?

A vibrator under the seat? Maybe it was an albino Torpedo:p

Looking forward to your tales mate.

ATB

CJ

Robusto

03-11-2009, 10:32 PM

Well I'm not sure how much feedback you guys want. After all, many of you are Cuba veterans, and I might lob in opinions that you disagree with.

I liked...

...that we decided to stay in two very good standard hotels in Havana - the Parque Central with its godsend of a swimming pool, and the less comfortable Telegrafo - and that we experienced a complete contrast by staying in a pretty basic but very friendly homestay in Trinidad with a lovely family. All four of us rated that lodging contrast as one of the best decisions we made before going.

I didn't like...

...feeling intimidated on some of the streets in Havana and Trinidad. I had no idea there would be as many men approaching with "You want to try a good cigar?". "You want to try good cannabis?". Once for dope. SCORES of times for cigars, with boxes of Cohibas LMFAO being flashed across the street 'in secret' from down dark passageways. No doubt oxen shit. Very funny.

I didn't walk round smoking very much. I was simply approached as a pale-skinned podgy European, usually in a Stetson. Easy target, really.

I was very successfully 'scammed' twice for milk from supermarkets. "You buy milk for my baby? I have sick baby" etc etc. Most scams started off very friendlily. One was clever. A guy struck up a friendship as I waited outside a photographic shop in his broken Spanish. He told me how great the Cuban health service is, and asked if Mrs Thatcher was still our leader. We split as I and the family walked on down the street. As I was crossing at a busy intersection, this guy slipped two (dreadful-looking) cigars into my top pocket. In the traffic, I shouted you didn't need to do that, sort of thing. I said to my boys we haven't seen the end of this. 50 metres later the guy was at my side. "You buy me milk...". I caved in, went into a supermarket and he asked for three litre boxes of fresh milk. I paid 7 Peros or so, but really didn't care by then. This was one of the funniest street scenes I'd ever gone through. After about three days of approaches, I learnt not to make eye contact and not to give a damn about the hands out and stories. I felt like a Brit shit in India, but what else to do?...

I am a big experienced boy, but this malarkey I didn't like at all. I felt very protective about my wife and two sons - but none of the four of us is super soppy or super touchy. I do think some people would be really shocked by this aspect of Cuban street life, so it's worth knowing the lie of the land on the hassle score. There were some Parisians in the lifts at the Parque Central. You know how good those women look in cashmere sweaters, with their kids in head to toe BABAR the Elephant clothes. I thought they would be rich pickings when the hotel door slid open. Believe me, the hassle started as quickly as that.

The funniest thing in the street scam for the three litres of milk was when my self-effacing wife held out a drug rep biro from her hospital as a sort of ... expresses it politely... "Please go away" gesture. The man was completely baffled at this, and eventually accepted it. Fabulous. My underwear is in moisture danger when I run that bit back in my mind and I'll never forget it.

More pro's and con's tomorrow if you can bear it.

To reassure: The pro's far outweigh the con's.

nicwing

03-11-2009, 10:54 PM

Oh yeh more more more Bryan, great down home stuff, real great insight. Love it. :cowboyic9: :cowboyic9: :cowboyic9: :cowboyic9:

cohibaIV

03-11-2009, 11:01 PM

More, More, More, and MORE....

Loving your insights mate....:biggrin1:

TJCoro

03-11-2009, 11:16 PM

:nerd: Muchachos, next time you visit Cuba, try showing 'em the back of your hand as they approach and keep moving with confidence....they'll leave you alone, guaranteed!

Works for me, anyway.:41: .

:shocked: BJ, BJCoro

:lol: Is this what you mean, BJ :thefinger: ?

:849:I just give 'em the "stink eye!" :twitch:

:juggle: I just show 'em me balls....they seem to like that!

ACMCC

04-11-2009, 01:31 AM

Very interesting Bryan, more info please m8, this is just the sort of thing I'd like to know, I'm thinking of going for the first time with the wife and one of her mate's (both would be very easy pickings for scams...:rolleyes:) I can see how the constant hassle would make you feel very protective, looking forward to your next update...:smoke:

Robusto

04-11-2009, 06:45 PM

Some more, then...

MONEY

Thanks to Craig and others earlier in the thread, we had no problems at all.

We took stacks of Sterling and were able to change a bit at the airport immediately. We changed the rest of the cash at the Exchange in the Parque Central Hotel. Note - Very long opening hours.

We took some more money out on NatWest and A&L credit cards and had to pay about 11% on each transaction.

We saw one set of ATMs when we were out and about in Havana but found it much more convenient to use the hotel facilities. It might have been cheaper somewhere else but we were sorted in our own way.

I used my NatWest card at the Partagas factory to stock up on great ones - then got a second cigar-buying urge at the casa in our hotel. Both times the cashiers pointed out that it would be 11% on top of the normal transaction. That still came to a great deal on top cigar purchases!

So... Plenty of cash and a credit card. And I did phone in advance to tell NatWest that I was off to Cuba.

I'll tell you if I've been hugely conned when I check my statements online. :biggrin1:

THE CIGARS. THE SMOKING.

What can I say?...

I have to be frank.

It was fucking marvellous to be able to smoke a cigar wherever I wanted to and whenever I wanted to without some idiot going off on a Health and Safety lung-protecting wanking arm flap to the nostrils, or a big gay "My Precious Health - You Will Die" speech.

My wife and two boys (17, 22) were absolutely fascinated by the Partagas Factory and the rollers and, indeed, the whole cigar-making process. So much so that later after our visit, I sat them down in a hotel lobby and taught them how to enjoy a good cigar. We toked on a phat one as a foursome. :biggrin1:

The bars and restaurants had smoking and non-smoking areas. Admittedly Cuba is open to the outside climate more than the UK, but NOBODY MADE A FUSS.

Interestingly, Cubans cannot smoke the Havanas we enjoy. I quote the guide in the factory because I asked him about it. He said the sticks are for export only, and that a good cigar would cost the average Cuban worker a month's salary to buy.

I have to say I was a bit shocked, even guilt-ridden, at this - and I made sure I did not smoke a good banded one out and about in the streets. I just thought I would get milked more (see above). I saw some Cuban men working cigars, but not many. It's more a cigarette smoker's place, I felt. Would be interested in what other visitors feel about that.

I did, however GO LARGE for the duration. I am a Robusto man, but I enjoyed, amongst others, single Sublimes, Gigantes (my first ones ever!), Lusitanias, some Romeo and Juliet phallic tower block thing... I can see the fantastic attraction of monster sticks because it is like smoking about five different types of cigars in one go.

I must say the Sublimes is a wonderful, wonderful cigar... I adore it.

I took out to Cuba two D4s in a small leather pocket case and got something like a weird sexual thrill when the Partagas tour took us to the box-filling bench. I had brought my D4 back 5,000 miles to be near its little cousins lined up on the workbench. It was cigar coitus in a bright red ring - and I've kept that a secret from anyone until this very typing. (I am thrilled by things like that. So sorry).

To puff a large one in front of salsa bands, in comfortable hotel lobbies until the wee small hours, on an open train up into the mountains above Trinidad, by the hotel pool, in the bars and clubs... This is greatly what my trip was about.

I've written on here in the past how much I miss not being able to enjoy a cigar in a pub. I used to do that in the Summer on my way home from work. Break the journey. Relax.

Well... The Cubans can still do that, and nobody is screaming.

Big_T_UK

04-11-2009, 06:50 PM

But what did you.....BRING BACK WITH YOU? LOL

T.

Lee Nub

04-11-2009, 06:51 PM

Sounds like a truly wonderfull experience, I need to work on the wife now to go :)

nicwing

04-11-2009, 07:05 PM

Wonderful Bryan, great prose man. I feel like I was there.

If it's OK with you I am going to cut and paste your stuff and give it to our dentist who is off to Cuba in a couple of weeks. I expect that will be worth a free clean!!

Looking forward to hearing about Trinidad and the differences between Havana and the country.
N

Ryan

04-11-2009, 07:06 PM

Great info Robusto, thanks for sharing that. How do you rate the Parque Central? I'm spending 10 days myself there in February.
Does the casa in the hotel have a decent selection?
Did you pick up any custom roll cigars on your travels around the shops/factories?

Drewmidorn

04-11-2009, 07:06 PM

Cigar wise it sounds like you've had an awesome time.... and what else matters? lol

ACMCC

04-11-2009, 07:35 PM

Great info Bryan, thanks. :smoke:

How did you get on with the food? I've heard it's not too good, I bet the music was great!. Did you feel that the street life was mostly scams? or did you get the feeling that you could be robbed? I guess you had 4 allowances for smoke's to bring back....:biggrin1: what did you pick? all and any info... great, when it comes back to you and you get time..Cheers :smoke:

Stevieboy

04-11-2009, 10:26 PM

It was cigar coitus in a bright red ring

You can get Preparation H for that mate.....

Stevieboy

04-11-2009, 10:27 PM

Good to hear your tales Bryan....lucky bastich :thumb:

Deano

05-11-2009, 10:08 AM

Sounds bloody excellent!

Robusto

05-11-2009, 11:04 AM

Guys.

I'll try and make this the last-ish post on my visit.
I did keep a detailed journal for the week. I always do for great holidays.

Big T - My Humidoro seven drawer humi is as rammed as it has ever been and I am happy. I will look at the box labels when I get home some time.

Ryan - I would give an absolute green light to the Parque Central. Have confidence. It's comfortable. It has a good lobby. It has a casa del habano.

The casa was reasonably well stocked and great for singles. Great staff and a fabulous floppers' lounge if you wanted to smoke one off in their premises. I usually smoked in the hotel lobby. The Partagas factory is ten minutes' walk away and is like a sweet shop! Take your pick - but be prepared for cigar street hassle as you approach Partagas. It was quite extraordinary! Vociferous liggers "with Partagas ID papers" on the very steps of the factory! :) Hassle City!

We avoided the Steak House at the Parque because it seemed VERY pricey and too European. The breakfasts in the deal we had were absolutely fantastic. Very European, I guess - hotel previously German-owned, now Spanish-owned - but I am a FANATIC FOR FRUIT and wanted to eat loads out in Cuba... and I'm pleased to say I ate loads of fruit I had never eaten before and am now as happy as Larry. The breakfasts also kept my meat eater side thrilled as well. Top marks to the hotel.

I didn't try any custom rolled cigars. We could have headed over to Vinales (where I think Craig got some fresh ones in his write-up) and been treated to that, but decided to walk all over Havana off the tourist routes instead. I got two cigars shoved in my pocket (see earlier) but I dumped those close to the Hotel Nacional fearing they might explode.

ACMCC

Food - Well catered for in the hotel. Plenty of restaurants at low prices. Simple menus in the streets invariably accompanied with rice, black beans. Meat usually chicken or pork. Fairly simply cooked. In other words, not top top cuisine choices, really. In our homestay, we had the same essentials listed plus MASSES of fresh fruit (this in Trinidad, btw), plus red snapper (delicious), lobster, prawns. GREAT bread in Cuba, we thought, and in the homestay lots of eggs and omelettes. The freshness of the eggs and bread was quite remarkable. Loads of restaurants in toutisty Havana with very similar menus. In Trinidad, I thought there was a bit more variety, but we mostly ate at home.

FANTASTIC music in both cities. Fantastic quality of musicianship. On squares. In streets. In bars. I recorded several on my phone camera. We have three mounds of pictures. I've put some on Facebook. I'll try and transfer them. SALSA everywhere - and no 'Western' pop music - which was brilliant!

I did indeed feel I might be robbed but will come back to that later. I'm slipping this out from time off at work. :)

Deano

05-11-2009, 11:07 AM

It's funny, I was never hassled at all - one smoking lady wanted some coin for a pic, which I obliged to, and a couple of girls asked me if I liked girls (etc). Maybe I was fortunate!

MaledettoToscano

05-11-2009, 11:53 AM

Thanks for sharing Robusto, a pleasure to read!

Robusto

05-11-2009, 12:15 PM

Maybe this was because we went in Autumn, Deano?
Or maybe I have a tattoo that says TARGET FOR A SCAM on my forehead?
I really don't know!

I think we did benefit from going at the end of October. The plane flights were rammed, btw. We were often four people with perspiration on our faces in a crowd with no trace of facial beading. I mean we had beautiful artistic droplets. Not barrel-loads above the eyebrows.

I have to say my sense of being unsettled started on the coach ride in from Havana airport to Havana city centre late at night. I am just not used to seeing hundreds of people sitting outside near midnight at home. (My family thought I was over the top about being concerned about this, btw). I stress that I did not let this lead me to the conclusion that I might be mugged. One quick incident over MONEY FOR BABY turned tinily unpleasant, and where most scammers just gave up if ignored, one family kept the heat up a bit, stirring their kids to show 'tude (as my sons sniggered later).

I did tell my boys and wife that they were not to wander off willy-nilly. I don't often put my foot down in any way, but my "just in case" antennae were erect.

I've had Army training (no joke) and I do tend to be on amber or red alert whenever I leave my front door. Fuck - It's not the set of 28 Days Later in Cuba or in the UK. I am simply a very cautious man, and the number of confident approaches by strangers in the street made me jump to Possible Mugging Scenario Mode. And I felt that in Havana and Trinidad on several occasions.

My boys are 6'2" and 6'4". I am 6'.
I saw this as an attraction AND a deterrent.
And all the Cuban folk we spoke to as human beings were extremely friendly and inquisitive. They were particularly inquisitive about my boys' height. Basketball, and all that.

I'll shut up on that in case you think I'm a fascist bigot.
I refer you to my first post where I said this was not a place for the precious - and I really believe that. Shoot me down - but I say Stick Together.

And so, Nic, to the contrasts of city vs country.

The countryside was amazingly lush and green. We walked around Trinidad, and also made the to-and-fro drive by comfortable coaches for each five hour journey.

Road travel was interesting. Motorways were not crowded. People often blocked the first two lanes holding out banknotes to cadge a lift. Women would hold out baskets of fruit towards the passing vehicles. People parked at the side whenever. Our coach driver pulled over to buy a papaya from a guy who walked to the carriageway from a farm. Motorway stop-offs were remarkably good.

Smaller roads had us waiting behind horses, carts, tractors. Very much like south-east Kent in that sense. My journey to work in the morning, really.

We stayed with a nurse and she hit it off with us because that is my wife's profession, too. There was a tendancy to pre-arrange visits for us. (I sniffed friends of friends because I'm a cynic). I made my NO very clear to that from the outset, but still the 'man with the horses' arrived at the front door, and had to be told NO.

Homestay was overwhelmingly positive and friendly. We were well fed and well greeted.

Trinidad was just as hassling to tourists on foot - and I reckon we were a smaller number of targets than in Summer. We went to some great music bars in Trinidad. Just wonderful. If you go, the cobbled streets are very tiring indeed.

As a family, we have started taking tourist trails after years of resisting them. Although I worried about taking an old steam train from Trinidad up into the surrounding hills, it turned out to be a glorious thing to do. An open-sided carriage on a hot day up through all that fresh air (whilst enjoying a Partagas) in beautiful surroundings and then visiting an ex sugar plantation and reflecting on how crap it would have been for the African slaves chucked in there... Extraordinary.

And what beautiful countryside!

The same goes for the beach we visited at the Ancon peninsula where we all melted into the beautifully warm water or lolled around under the palms with coconuts on the beach. Hardly another person there. Just glorious.

So. Without developing this into a ceaseless life-story...

Would I recommend Cuba for a visit?
A thousand times YES.

What REALLY surprised you, Bryan?
The vehicles. The number of brand-new spanking great vehicles in Havana alongside old wrecks of cars, including many old Chevrolets, and so on. Alongside the rickshaws.

What else?
The fact that for a week I was so pleased not to be surrounded by the usual city stuff of Burger King, KFC, Starbucks... The fact there was hardly any advertising in the street,and certainly not for big companies. OK... Havana Club got through the net LOL... The fact that there were no places to buy a British newspaper, and that they weren't put out in the hotels. I realised this as soon as I got back and saw some shit about The Twins on the front of a newspaper... The way the satellite channels seemed really alien with their fixations on Dominos Pizzas, and so on...

I guess this touches on the philosophical differences between 'the West' and Cuba, in a way, though I never spoke to anyone about that. I kept it all up top with my red banded coitus. We all enjoyed the slogans for PATRIA O MUERTE etc on houses and walls, and had some wry observations about them.

Give one more example of what surprised you, Sir.

It has to be the contradictions.

You can sit on the steps of the Capitolo and look at Havana, or out of a hotel bedroom. You can see repaired and maintained buildings wedged in with totally decayed ones. Delapidation. I was surprised that the authorities would not have tried to window-dress their capital city a bit more. Maybe I have missed the point utterly?...

I was astounded at the main square with massive monuments and window-sides with illuminated faces of Che and Castro that there was a metal staircase down to a roadside with about seven metal steps all decayed away so that pedestrians had to jump a massive gap.

Somebody needs to deal with PR there. And around the place generally.

I just want to say - in my defence, chaps - I am an educated man who has travelled around most of Europe as well as the US, particularly New Mexico and Northern Mexico. I speak two other major European languages fluently.

I have no truck with racist generalisations. My observations on Cuba should not be seen in any dodgy way, therefore. Just the thoughts of a man who loved the odd cigar who had his 50th birthday treat pepped up in an amazing way. And went to Cuba partly because of the enthusiasm for all things Cuban gleaned through other folks' posts on this website.

I felt a duty in these rushed posts to reflect both sides of the coin - as I experienced it - to BOTL who might be thinking of visiting.

I'm quite prepared to be flamed, btw. :) I don't have all the answers!

Above all, do go and visit Cuba!

Deano

05-11-2009, 12:22 PM

*sigh* you make this forum great Bry.

Robusto

05-11-2009, 12:37 PM

PS This was better than doing the 'real' work on my desk this morning. :biggrin1:

Robusto

05-11-2009, 12:43 PM

*sigh* you make this forum great Bry.

Mate.

My desire to experience Cuba was brought on greatly by the fact that you created this site. You and other enthusiasts in this series of boxes on our screens got me more interested than I had been before.

If you ever feel like swapping inclinations, getting inventive and trying the red band coitus, just buzz me, buddy. :smoke:

Harry The Hetero xxxxx

(Note - With no offence to any cigar kittens and ferrets anywhere at all).

MaledettoToscano

05-11-2009, 12:46 PM

I have no truck with racist generalisations. My observations on Cuba should not be seen in any dodgy way, therefore. Just the thoughts of a man who loved the odd cigar who had his 50th birthday treat pepped up in an amazing way. And went to Cuba partly because of the enthusiasm for all things Cuban gleaned through other folks' posts on this website.

Robusto, I think you made your point of view very clear, and personally I see no generalisations or in no way does it seem you're trying to put things across in a dodgy way. At the same time I really appreciate that you are not candy coating your experience :hail:.

Heck, I would probably say half the things you have written here referring to the place where I spent almost 20 years of my life, Naples (Italy not Florida :eviltongue:)... a place where you should always have your antennas turned on :cool:!

Nuno Sa

05-11-2009, 12:50 PM

I´m devouring this posts as i have the intention of visiting Cuba perhaps in 2010.

Great writing Bryan, i do now what you mean and felt, i visited Morocco for three times now and i now who to deal with the locals who are experts in making a living by any means necessary, life is hard in this country's, but they are so good for a nice holidays.

Socialism such a beauty full utopic ideology trampled by human nature every ware.

Robusto

05-11-2009, 12:56 PM

I have to say, guys, that I kept thinking about what Cuba has got - and what Cuba has not got.

I have to say even if North Korea had excellent cigars, I wouldn't pop there.

It has made me examine the fact that I am a massive news-hound and listen constantly to Radio 4 all day long.

This morning I switched the news off. That's unusual for me.

I am left-of-centre in my thinking, btw.
Very nice with it. Not too chain-sawed.

PoohBore

05-11-2009, 12:57 PM

I've enjoyed your posts immensely. Perhaps your stetson flagged you as an affluent tourist ?:biggrin1: I had one of the guided day trips to havanna and we had the dilapidation pointed out to us but it was followed up with renovation works are slowly starting. Obviously slower in that part of the world..

I can't wait now for April to come round and get on the plane. btw need to see some photos of the cigars

Robusto

05-11-2009, 01:02 PM

Next stop some bright red ring snaps.
I'll see if I can do it!

Ryan

05-11-2009, 04:00 PM

peanutpete

05-11-2009, 07:27 PM

thanks for the posts Robusto, i have enjoyed reading them enormously i love the the way you told it just the way you saw it, the good and the bad

Robusto

05-11-2009, 07:28 PM

Great reports Robusto, thanks for all the info.
I'm looking forward to my trip more than ever now. Good to hear you had such a good time.
Last questions, is there anything you didn't have you, that you couldn't get there and that you wish you had brought? Small bottle of Tabasco for example? Or anything you wish you had brought for the people you met?

Great questions, Ry. :smoke:

I don't think we forgot anything. I like a clean shave around my fuzz so made sure we had ample batteries and took plug adaptors and phone chargers. 02 was more Cuba-friendly than Orange for mobiles, but they all routed through Cubacel.

My wife was forward-thinking and took a well-packed family first aid kit, topped up with hospital supplies. I know it would have been expensive to not have some of that had we been ill.

I could not decide on a book and had no time before Gatwick to buy one. I borrowed my wife's copy of The Old Man and The Sea by Ernest Hemingway. I knew Hemingway was a man's man, that he featured large in Cuban and Havana life. This was a simple little tale and very easy to read. Enjoyable. It's set off the Havana coast. I won't spoil it, but the author sure knew how to dispense of a big one that rises up on you.

I will read more Hemingway. I had never read him before. Does anyone know if he was a cigar man? He has many of the traits in his writing.

It would have been foolhardy not to take suntan lotion, btw.

FOR THE PEOPLE WE MET

They were reliant upon tourism for their well-being. Homestay families. They were very, very sweet and I wish we had taken something very appropriate for them. It is only after you have discovered people like that that you know what would be suitable, of course. Our lives and standard of living were very separated so some of the things I might have naturally given would not be appropriate to them. We will keep in contact. Not by email. They don't have it.

Just to finish... I must say how cheap it was to use taxis in the cities. Use the state-owned taxis so you don't get ripped off. We were advised to haggle the prices down and this was successful in all but one case.

Thank you, gentlemen, for your comments through the end of this thread. I had a lot to write - mostly undercover at work LOL - and I seem to have passed through haughtily without personal address. Sorry.

It has been great to chunder away in writing because I'm missing Cuba a lot. We all are here!

I wanted to blurt these refections out on the site whilst the memories remain fresh.

jdawg

05-11-2009, 08:37 PM

Thanks for the update, Bryan! I love reading the details of your trip. It sounds like you had an amazing time, aside from the constant harrassment. To smoke cigars freely anywhere while listening to live salsa bands play is a wonderful thing. Keep the updates coming, along with some pics when you get a chance.

cj121

05-11-2009, 09:01 PM

Beautiful as ever Bryan, and for you to flourishingly express your experiences about the motherland is a bonus. I'm glad for you and yours:smile:

nicwing

05-11-2009, 10:04 PM

Absolutely wonderful write up Bry, thanks for taking the time out of your busy days to type this lot up.

I also saw some of the photo's you and David posted on Facebook and it looks as though you had a great time, looking forward to seeing more.

Thanks matey! :41: :41: :41:

cohibaIV

05-11-2009, 10:31 PM

Robusto

05-11-2009, 10:48 PM

I've just uploaded 300-odd snaps to Photobucket so will try to select a handful to put here at the weekend.

Meanwhile I'll break a UK law...

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h304/elton1984/Cuba%20October%202009/DSC00332.jpg?t=1257461691

cj121

05-11-2009, 11:12 PM

You naughty pig in sh..:smile:

ACMCC

06-11-2009, 12:42 AM

Great write up Bryan, gives me a good feel for what to expect. I love Cuban music and can't wait to visit :biggrin1: will certainly be going next year. Thinking of the Habanos festival, but I have a few things that might get in the way around that time...may juggle them around!

Looking forward to the photo's and cigar info - when you get time....Cheers:smoke:

Deano

06-11-2009, 03:11 PM

You naughty pig in sh..:smile:

lol exactly what I was going to say!!!

cbob

07-11-2009, 03:53 AM

Excellent report Bryan!!

That's a great pic of you in the Parque Central too- if I'm wandering in Habana Vieja and get caught short I always head for the upstairs at PC. Nicest washrooms in the neighborhood! :p

A couple of comments if I may :

The Stetson is a "less than good" idea at any time in Cuba. It marks you as a "Yuma" (American) and guarantees a tout convention wherever you go. For your next trip, consider a plain straw fedora.
Don't feel bad about the "Milk For My baby" scam. It's been going on successfully for much longer than I have been visiting The Island (1996) and "Extraneros" (tourists) are choice targets. The milk that you buy (they will never accept money) is sold back to the store where you bought it and the tout and the merchant split your generosity. The government guarantees milk for every Cuban child up to the age of 7 years and in fact, they are the only ones in Cuba who get whole milk- adults are not allowed to purchase it unless it is for a child (and they have to prove it) so they must use powdered milk they mix with local water. Coffee drinkers beware that if a new friend offers you milk for your coffee in their home, it's made with tap water.
The "11% surcharge" on your CCs is simply the conversion from CUC to USD. Your card will be chaged in USD and converted to your local currency. If you do the calculation when you get your statements, you will find that you paid the same as if you had converted your money to CUC and paid cash -although that does depend a bit on the value of the GBP against the USD. Two years ago, when our CAD was actually higher than the USD, I made a 2% profit using my VISA!
The Partagas rollers actually make a very good wage (for Cuba) but a Serie D No.4 is only about 1/2 month's salary. :biggrin1: BTW, you should have tried those cigars the "local" put in your pocket The local "tabacos" (cigars) sell for $1 CUP each ( 1/24 of a CUC- no kidding) and some are surprisingly decent. I always smoke a Reloba or two on my visits.
The Parque Central was not German but was originally one of the Dutch "Tulip" chain run by KLM. I believe it is now managed by one of the Cuban tourist boards.
Your perception of Havana as "crumbling" is correct but since Old Havana was made a UNESCO Heritage Site some years ago, they are renovating as many of the old buildings as possible rather than tearing them down to build modern replacements. There are some very nice examples scattered around the city and worth hunting up on a future visit. Why don't the Cubans add more "window dressing"? It's very simple: they are dead broke. Nobody likes all the broken pavement, missing manholes and balconies falling in the street but they simply have no way to buy materials and make repairs. Often, buildings that have been condemned and have sat empty for some time will suddenly be descended upon by people from the neighborhood who in a few hours will totally cannibalize the building, carrying away every brick, tile, window and wire to use in renovating their own homes.

I'm looking forward to more of your comments and photos as you get a chance to "decompress".

Cheers,

Robusto

07-11-2009, 11:10 AM

I am really pleased you commented on my comments, CPN BOB. I thought your stuff was insightful earlier on and was going to ask you to comment by dropping a PM quite soon.

Just off out... but I did realise quite quickly that the Stetson wasn't right at all when out and about so did go around showing my British hair most of the time.

There were lots of your recommended hats about, but they're really not for me lol. (No offence to anyone. They look very Middle Class. Although I am Middle Class, I'm definitely not that type of MC. I'd rather be a Cowboy any day. Swarms of those hats in the Virgin return queue, btw).

The milk thing is helpful. I was VERY confused by what was going on!

I was brushed up by the Telegrafo staff for "You want to try my cigar collection?" just before leaving and I did almost cave in. I didn't know if I'd get quality or bananas. I should have lobbed a few Pesos because I've enjoyed a mock Cohiba or two before.

Maybe next time.

That won't be soon because I have other playgrounds in mind now.

But there probably will be a next time when we have retired. :biggrin1:

Robusto

07-11-2009, 02:00 PM

WHY is Cuba so broke?

Would KFC clear the debt?

Will KFC be there soon?

You know what I mean. And I do not mean that facetiously.

External investment would provide cash for manhole covers.

(I did not want to mention that we nearly fell down three).

What is going to happen to Cuba?

Discuss.

whisky77

07-11-2009, 02:52 PM

Bryan, there is external investment, especially from China, Venezuela, Holland and Spain.

The trade embargo is the main reason that there is a lack of infrastructure, and until that ends there will be little that can be done to build the economic framework to allow the country to progress.

Although there is an export market for the raw minerals, oil, sugar which Cuba does export, the influence and relationships which America holds on the worlds trading countries means that the US has done everything within its power over the years to ensure the Cuban people are made to suffer.

Both Ronald Regan and George Bush went out of their way to enforce the embargo and tighten the reciprocal trading agreements which Cuba would otherwise enjoy.All ships entering Cuba are barred from entering a US port for something like 90 days.This breaks all international trading laws, but it still happens.

I think that the Cubans do want the embargo to end, without having to endure the influx of KFC, Starbucks etc which outside investment from the US would bring.

nicwing

07-11-2009, 04:18 PM

Guys.

I thought that all of this information was far to good to just head off into the archives of the Forum.

A friend of mine is heading out to Cuba in a couple of weeks so I checked with Robusto that he was cool and cut and pasted the good stuff into an email for him.

I have also posted the same stuff into the Cigarwikipedia under the heading 'Going to Cuba'

this is mainly just stream of conciousness stuff (in Robusto's own unique stylee). As and when I get time I will try to pull it into some form of headings - Cigars, money, bars, women etc etc.

However as it's a Wiki entry please don't be backwards in comming forward and get stuck in and do your bit if you feel the need to help.

Robusto

07-11-2009, 05:49 PM

Craig.

Thank you.

In my quiet times alone, I was thinking about oil, water supplies, etc, being the investment priorities (and cons). I think it would be great for Cuba to attain that level of investment without the fast-food outlets, too.

Friends came round last night and we couldn't work out how the power system is maintained. Are the Police vicious behind the scenes, for example? The people we saw were not unhappy. My tales of street hassle did not brew up into physical threats or violence towards us other visitors.

I sat in very comfortable tourist state-owned coaches (I think from Korea) and crossed my part of the island. The Cuban public - in Havana - waited for cross-city buses which were RAMMED, and I phone-video'd a normal bus draw up outside the Capitolo (sic?) where an absolute horde of city dwellers were trying to get on their service bus. It seemed third-worldly.

If this situation - the preference to the tourist - were to be mine in Kent, UK, I'd start objecting somehow, and eventually I would start shouting about it. Do folk not object in Cuba because they will be locked up? Or shot? (Only a bit of a joke, that).

I do not know why the tourist vs populace disparity continues. Or how/why the locals tolerate it.

I had my hair cut in town today and the chat at the barber's was all about the blocked drain in the pedestrian precinct. Some chap next to me had written endless letters to the Council and the papers and there was talk of local corruption.

At least people can babble and do something here, however much of a gesture. And I'm sure it will be attended to before any balconies fall to the street, as it were.

PS Nic (et autres). I'm sorry about my babble style on here but I have to be so formal when writing for work. It's a pleasure to dribble amongst BOTL like this, and I haven't got the time to raise my game to a scholarly level for these threads.

Oh. And I do like to drizzle a smut reference which might taint the sensitive reader.
Apologies. :smoke:

cbob

07-11-2009, 07:35 PM

In my quiet times alone, I was thinking about oil, water supplies, etc, being the investment priorities (and cons). I think it would be great for Cuba to attain that level of investment without the fast-food outlets, too.
Almost everyone was frightened off, especially in the two BUSH eras by the threats from the USA. This included the UK, with Tony in the "Yumas" pocket. Canada thumbed its nose and continued to trade but it's a drop in the bucket since Cuba exports very little. France was an early investor (15 years ago they installed state of the art phone systems with smart cards) but soon backed off. The Italians have been supportive -many of the appliances that Cubans with CUCs can buy are from Italy. Korea also has been supportive which is why you see so many Kias and Hyundais and LG TVs but they do not build roads and fix buildings. Venezuela sells oil to Cuba but then there is no love lost between Chavez and the USA.

One of my favorite things about Cuba is the lack of "American" culture -no KFC, no MacDonalds, no Starbucks, no Burger King and especially, althought it is not American, no 7-11.

Friends came round last night and we couldn't work out how the power system is maintained. Are the Police vicious behind the scenes, for example? The people we saw were not unhappy. My tales of street hassle did not brew up into physical threats or violence towards us other visitors.

Mostly, the power system is not maintained. Things are better now than 15 years ago but there are still regular brownouts and during the summer they shut the power off completely in various parts of Havana on a regular basis-sometimes announced, sometimes not.

There are several levels of police and the PNR (the grey tunics you see doing traffic patrol in their LADAS) are generally despised. Most of the cops in the PNR are "palestinos", imports from the western provinces who have no interest or appreciation for locals in the cities. Many, if not most of them are black and despite the claims of "the revolution", racism is rife in Cuba.

I sat in very comfortable tourist state-owned coaches (I think from Korea) and crossed my part of the island. The Cuban public - in Havana - waited for cross-city buses which were RAMMED, and I phone-video'd a normal bus draw up outside the Capitolo (sic?) where an absolute horde of city dwellers were trying to get on their service bus. It seemed third-worldly.

Of course it's "third worldly" Bryan. When news media talk about countries where people live on $1/day or $2/day, remember your visit with the people of Cuba who live on perhaps 10 pesos/ day -at 24 CUP/ CUC that is less than 50 US cents/day. What's that in GBP? That's a tragedy.
If it was not for heavy government subsidization of housing (rent can be $1/month) food (although the monthly ration-card items run out in about 2 weeks) and transport, folks would be starving. As it is, they are merely hungry. many Cubans make a "fortune" working in the tourist industry where they can earn more in tips in a day than a professional (doctor, lawyer, engineer) makes in a month. There is also a fair amount of "hard currency" coming in from family living abroad but despite the 'trickle down" from these relatively wealthy Cubans, the majority of working folk are dirt poor.

China (not Korea) sold Cuba (at a good discount) several thousand of those new Yutong buses you saw and they replaced most of the really decrepit buses that used to run (or not) throughout Cuba. There are not many of the old "camel" buses left. They kept a few and painted them bright colours -pink, blue, yellow- for tourists to photograph. The "guagua" (bus) costs 50 centavos (that's 1/2 of 1/24 of a CUC) to ride because the government subsidizes the transport. They just don't provide enough of it. Lobby your MP to donate some new bendy-buses to Cuba!
The cost of a Viazul tourist bus from Havana to Trinidad is less than the price of my cab ride to the airport but it's a month's wages for a Cuban.

If this situation - the preference to the tourist - were to be mine in Kent, UK, I'd start objecting somehow, and eventually I would start shouting about it. Do folk not object in Cuba because they will be locked up? Or shot? (Only a bit of a joke, that).

Folks do protest in Cuba. But it's a socialist dictatorship-nobody listens. If you "shout about it" too much, you get hassled. Jailed. Outcast.
They can't phone up their local MP and rant. There is no MP. The only local representative is the CDR member who monitors every move in the neighborhood and reports "Un-revolutionary" behavior to the government.
MININT (Ministry of the Interior -Secret Police) members are everywhere (they are the cars with the green license plates) and I seldom wear a Guyabera (that iconic Cuban shirt) in Havana because it is well known that MININT detectives wear Guyaberas and shiny shoes and dark glasses.
Tourists don't see this.

I do not know why the tourist vs populace disparity continues. Or how/why the locals tolerate it.

Tourists have money. Locals have none. Tolerance is the only option. It's not a "free country". See above,

I had my hair cut in town today and the chat at the barber's was all about the blocked drain in the pedestrian precinct.

:biggrin1: The same conversation could be had at your Cuban barber shop. The difference would be that nothing could be done about the drains and your haircut would cost about $20 pesos - less than $1 US. (Haircuts are subsidized)

I really enjoy Bryan's keen and insight-provoking observations of the Cuban scene and I hope he and you all will forgive my extensive commentary. The reality of Cuba has very little to do with rum and cigars. Most Cubans know nothing about cigars, except that tourists want them, and they drink home-brew rum that they buy from a neighbor (if they bring an empty bottle).

If you want a really alternative view (much tougher than my biased one) of the current situation before you visit the island, I can recommend several of the blogs published by some of those intolerant Cubans Bryan wonders about.

Links to several Blogs in English translation are included on this site:

http://octavocercoen.blogspot.com/

(list down on the right side of the page)

But be warned : these folks are banned in Cuba. They live there, but their Blogs are not viewable in Cuba. Yoani Sanchez is prevented from leaving the country to collect awards she has won for her work. They are militant, outspoken and from my own POV, they may be exaggerating for effect. I know that some of the "problems" they protest are not strictly in effect but who am I to protest their righteous indignation. Fascinating reading for those interested though!
.

nicwing

07-11-2009, 07:57 PM

Bryan
Please do not stop your 'babble'. I can say that I love your straight to the point unfiltered and unedited thoughts. Raw but pure I would say.

Put with that Captain Bob's comments and this is turning into an incredible thread.

I would bet there is anything like this anywhere else on the web, it's thoughtful and thought provoking. It by passes all the tourist clap trap and get's to the roots and truth of Cuba.

Thanks-you both for some really great posts and keep in coming guys, This is the first thread I look for everytime I log in.

Drewmidorn

07-11-2009, 09:47 PM

Wow!

D

Robusto

08-11-2009, 02:15 AM

I did no preparation before going because my work is stressful currently, and because I wanted an adventure.

To say I found the trip interesting is an understatement. I'm sure what I'm writing is naive.

But so what?

I have more questions.

A musician friend tells me there is an American who collects things to ship to Havana. He sent over a load of second-hand unwanted pianos to Cuba and they were not allowed in. That's something dear to my heart - tinkling - and it seems a bit pathetic to stop joy coming in. Why does that sort of thing happen?

Also I kept thinking about my namesake George Orwell when I was out there. Especially parts of 1984. I'm thinking of the slogans about the revolution and the party. They seemed to be daubed and painted on some VERY run-down walls and houses to the extent that it was very funny. We will win the revolution... painted on a wreck of a property, or a delapidated house. I'm sorry, but my British irony red band coitus moved in my shorts. It was just like some of the positive sloganeering in 1984.

I wondered whether the people who had the most slogans were keeping in the political good books. Perhaps they'd get a surprise tin of Carnation from Fidel one day. (Apologies).

I dunno.

If a D4 is a month's or half a month's wages, should I give up cigars and just get 20 fags from up the BP garage? We loved our holiday, but I'm feeling a sort of existential guilt in a way. Certainly a guilt about the value of a cigar that coils away to nothing in the end. (I smoked some ripe beauties from the factory today so the guilt isn't quite taking over).

I will follow up those Blog references over time.

Bob - What exactly do you do / have you done Cuba-wise? Is this interest and knowledge coming solely from many years of visits to Cuba, or are you in Business or Politics, maybe?

cbob

08-11-2009, 03:53 AM

Sadly, since I posted an obviously premature reading of the Cuban Bloggers as "exaggerating for effect" it appears that to prevent a couple of them from attending a demonstration today, they were kidnapped and badly beaten by plain-clothes police in an unmarked car then dumped on the street.

I'm on your side with all of your observations Bryan and I'm just a long-time cigar fan and Cuba visitor (more than 20 visits over almost 15 years) who quietly observes the scene. No political or business interests -I'm retired and spending as much time as I can afford on a Cuban beach with a fine Cuban cigar. I go to Cuba because it is a relatively short and affordable trip from Canada and I'm not paying those huge resort prices in Mexico or getting my ass mugged in Jamaica. When the embargo falls and the Americans arrive, pockets bulging with cash, and all the prices triple or quadruple, I'll probably be forced to stop visiting.

The Cubans are warm and hospitable and I really like the music. Unfortunately it is harder and harder to ignore all the problems I see every time I visit. My policy is "it's their country and not my place as a guest to criticize". That does not stop me reporting what I see.
Be sure that at least a portion of the money you spend on The island will assist in modernizing the infrastructure and raising the standard of living. Without tourist dollars they would have almost nothing.
I try to buy all my cigars in-country so that the money stays there. As a pensioner, I really can't afford to buy boutique non-Cuban smokes anyway.

About the pianos: this is unusual.
There must have been a breakdown in protocol somewhere in the donation process.
Canadians regularly collect and donate instruments for Cuba and they are much appreciated.
Canadian jazz musician Jane Bunnett has been traveling to Cuba for 20 years or so and has recorded several albums and videos with the band "Spirits of Havana" in Canada and in Cuba. She normally takes instruments and technicians with her to Cuba and they put on seminars and repair instruments for schools. If you are interested in some good music and "another" side of Cuba as it was just a few years ago, search out this documentary from the National Film Board of Canada.

http://www.allmovie.com/work/jane-bunnett-cuban-odyssey-spirit-of-havana-281927

No "Buena Vista Social Club" here but some great Cuba footage and amazing music.
.

Robusto

08-11-2009, 11:27 AM

Drewmidorn

08-11-2009, 11:57 AM

It does make you wonder whether one should be buying cigars.

nicwing

08-11-2009, 12:43 PM

The money from the cigar trade must trickle down to the people some how doesn't it? If this is a communist state, and the state owns the cigar production?

I appreciate that the US embargo cuts out a major export market which ultimately restrict the amount of money in the system.

So surely the problem is we are all smoking too few cigars!?!

What else generates money. Much of the tourist trade revolves around the cigar trade so smoke up chaps.

But them I did European/North American political geography and missed Economics at school so what the F"<$ do I know.

Answers on a post card please.

Nuno Sa

08-11-2009, 01:23 PM

The problem with communism states is that stuff don´t really belong to the people, the party makes what they see fit with the money. Private property is not allowed, but the higher hierarchy members have access to many goods and property that simple people can´t.

nicwing

08-11-2009, 02:16 PM

So what would be the result of stopping smoking Cuban Cigars, other than total miserableness and dismay??
:( :confused: :mad: :eek: :eek: :mad: :confused: :(

Robusto

08-11-2009, 02:41 PM

It does make you wonder whether one should be buying cigars.

That is what I have been thinking, too.

I watched my language when I typed some of this on my kitchen table and sofa.

When I said the sight of the horde of people getting on to the bus made me think of a sort of third World state... it actually DID make me think of a third World state. The coach drive from the airport to the Parque Central left me aghast on the first night, to be honest. There is a lot of squalor. The closest I've been to it in Europe is wandering all over Marseille back from the port.

My wife has worked in Uganda. When we compared and contrasted, she saw huge similarities between the two countries. The biggest difference was that ultra poor Ugandans have to make homes in bushes on streets. I'm guessing that the populace IS housed by the state... and I can tell you that the family where we stayed for three days explained to us that the money we put on the table was INVALUABLE to them and would conjure up much more than four lobster suppers...

We first went to Thomas Cook to enquire about Cuban holidays and were pointed at Varadero. Azure pools. Glorious beaches. I found the whole experience very Stepford Wives, to be frank, and we moved on.

No offence to anyone on here who has flown in and out of Varadero and stayed there - and I know several have because we have talked about destinations before - but that sort of hermetically sealed beach-based holiday is never what we look for when travelling abroad ANYWHERE.

I'm going to stop babbling very soon on this thread, but I do think knowing which Cuba you will see is vitally important before setting off.

cohibaIV

08-11-2009, 03:52 PM

I'm going to stop babbling very soon on this thread, but I do think knowing which Cuba you will see is vitally important before setting off.

I bloody fecking HOPE not????:eek:

cbob

08-11-2009, 06:53 PM

The money from the cigar trade must trickle down to the people some how doesn't it? If this is a communist state, and the state owns the cigar production?
That's very true Nic but it's one of Cuba's few exports and much of the actual trade/pricing etc. is controlled in part by Altadis, the Spanish/French consortium. Cuba gets only a small part of what you all buy from those online vendors.

I appreciate that the US embargo cuts out a major export market which ultimately restrict the amount of money in the system...What else generates money.

Not just the cigar market. Cuba has a large amount of nickle which is banned from import by the USA and those who they have intimidated.
Cuban sugar production has all but ceased after the Soviet market disappeared but the sugar producers in the US are still one of the major lobbies against dropping the embargo.
Cuban oil off the Matazas coast is high sulphur and of no vale but there are large high quality reserves off the North West coast that Cuba has no funds to develop. The Bolivians and the Chinese are presently in negotiations to exploit this oil but no dollars are flowing yet.

Much of the tourist trade revolves around the cigar trade so smoke up chaps.

Not so!
Because of our hobby and all this conversation about cigar travel, we get the impression that Cuba is crawling with cigar lovers but most of the tourist trade has nothing to do with cigars! You see very few cigar smokers at the resorts and my cigar companions and I are often the only ones smoking cigars in Havana. Most of the tourist trade was founded on Canadians, Germans and Italians flocking to all the newly-built resorts. Not so many Germans and Italians these days but more Scandinavians, Brits and Dutch. The flight from Europe is 10 hours long so not surprising that after the deadly 9/11 of 2001 the cross-ocean travel dried up in a major way.
Most of the folks who travel to the island expressly for cigars are a relatively small group that includes our friends Mitch from C-Gars, Simon Chase, Magali and other vendors, Nino and his wealthy (but very nice) Swiss friends and others we all know. You run into Naka-san (and James Sucking) wherever you go!
Still lots of Canadian money going to Cuba travel but in our small nation of 30-odd millions I probably know all the cigar smokers! :p
Most "tourons" buy fakes from the resort staff or street touts and then berate real cigar smokers for "paying too much from those ripoff government stores". :rolleyes:

So surely the problem is we are all smoking too few cigars!?!

:tongue: Truer words have seldom been spoken amigo! :smoke:

I believe I feel a smoke coming on right now!
.

cohibaIV

08-11-2009, 07:04 PM

Cbob...as with Robusto, please do not stop posting you fascinating personnel experiences and views....

I, like Nic - am loving this thread and the REAL views from out BOTL.

Many thanks mate.

Deano

08-11-2009, 07:07 PM

Ditto. This stuff is awesome reading.

PoohBore

08-11-2009, 07:23 PM

I'm off in April so this is an absolute must read :pop2::coffeepaper: so keep going guys.

cbob

08-11-2009, 07:40 PM

I'm going to stop babbling very soon on this thread, but I do think knowing which Cuba you will see is vitally important before setting off.
Please don't stop the flow Bryan!!
Your "eyes wide open" comments have been some of the most honest I've heard from "first time" Cuba visitors in years.
I normally keep my own observations to myself, sharing with fellow travelers upon specific request but not willing to argue "the Cuban experience" with the general hoard. Everyone has the right to their own interpretations of what they know, or in many cases imagine from guidebooks or :p cigar forums. heheeh
Your notes and questions have prompted me to share and I only hope that our exchanges are not alienating our fellow Habanophiles.
(Insert "buy Habanos not non-Cuban cigars" advert here :biggrin1: )

No offence to anyone on here who has flown in and out of Varadero and stayed there - and I know several have because we have talked about destinations before - but that sort of hermetically sealed beach-based holiday is never what we look for when travelling abroad ANYWHERE.

Now here I must dissent just a bit.
Some of my best "cigar friends" started their "Cuban adventures" with beach vacations to Varadero. Many have now refined their resort selections, settling on areas like Jibacoa (1/2 way between Havana and Varadero) after sampling other resort areas on the island and finding them fine for beaching but light on cigars. To be fair, many of my local cigar group now agree with you and simply head to Havana.
I differ.
While I enjoy Havana-walking the city, visiting the cigar shops, taking my Spanish lessons, I still long to lie back on a white-sand Cuban beach, looking out at the deep blue/turquoise water, feeling the warmth and the gentle breezes. My favorite mornings are when I can "assume the position" with a mug of Cuban coffee to hand and a tasty Habano. My favorite afternoons continue with tasty rum drinks and more Habanos. The beach is warm (and unlike many holiday destinations -clean) . The water is warm (and unlike many holiday destinations -clean) and the scenery, for a lecherous FOG can be most gratifying. In the soft warm Cuban evenings there is Cuban music, great conversation and of course lots more rum and Habanos.
Life is Good.

Many of the dozens of new giant resorts opened in Varadero over the past 5-6 years are isolated out on the far easten end of the penninsula, away from the town and all the good cigar stores and requiring a cab to get about. The cheapest hotels are really only suitable for backpackers and students and are mainly located on the west side near the entrance to Varadero - I'd give them a miss for various reasons but in between, conveniently near to the Casa del Habano and the Casa del Ron and walking distance to everything, there are a number of "older" (7-10 year old) resorts that provide everything you need for a relaxing vacation.
Despite my rantings about conditions in Cuba, I'm really just a selfish bastard who prefers to lie on the beach drinking rum and smoking cheap cigars. And despite reports to the contrary, Cuba is still the cheapest place to buy Habanos. :smoke: Heck, when my pension runs low, I can always smoke Relobas at $1/bundle.

PoohBore

08-11-2009, 07:52 PM

I'm a self confessed all inclusive holiday nut. I like to pay up front and not think about pacing my spending. I have stayed in the hotel as far east at Varadero as you can get. I'm staying midway between Havana and varadero in April and I'm planning on hiring a taxi for a few days to get out and about and see a little bit more than last time. This is great reading and stirring my interest in seeing a little more than the resort. So thankyou guys keep going !!!!

Robusto

08-11-2009, 10:13 PM

OK.

I thought this was getting a bit too 'heavy' for a website that is usually a load of blokes chatting about cigars they enjoy.

I ask myself a million questions if I pop out to Somerfield for a large white loaf. Cuba got my pulse racing.

Sorry if it has got on anyone's nerves. A number of people don't think cigars and Politics should mix, but there have been a number of revealing answers to what I was churning around like Hamlet in my nut.

I have just watched the two CHE films with Benecio del Toro (spellcheck please on that lol) and they are a tad long but very interesting, particularly the first film.

By the way... If I weren't a lardarse whose arms go pink as chipolatas in the slightest sun shaft, you could call me Varadero's King Dong. Because I go tomato red, I have to be in the shade. (Think Stetson. Think why).

Deano

09-11-2009, 10:20 AM

I've just read an 800 page biography on Che. A committed man, but I'm not sure I believe in his methods or the hero worship that's attributed to him.

Robusto

09-11-2009, 12:13 PM

I didn't know about what happened in South America, and how Castro read out a letter to explain Che's disappearance. The second film was really about battles in the mountains in Bolivia, and Che's attempt to move on la Revolucion.

It was a film and they can be candy floss.

You do like biogs, Deano! :biggrin1:

Pantomimehorse

09-11-2009, 10:00 PM

Ive got the two films sitting ready to watch, also The Motorcycle diaries was a fantastic road movie and well worth a watch if you havent seen it already

pirald

17-11-2009, 01:17 PM

I'm sure most of this is covered in other messages, however as I'm at work, and shouldn't really be browsing this, I'll summarise my experience of Cuba (I returned yesterday - 16 Nov 09).

- In Havana, expect to be badgered by locals and hotel staff alike. The Cuban people are very friendly, however given the depressed economic situation there is a real lack of money and basic provisions (such as medicines and toiletries especially)

If you wish to take any offerings as gifts I suggest simple things such as toothpaste, deodarant, perfume, aspirin, shower gel - any toiletries/medicines we regularly use)

Don't expect the food to be great - I struggled with this more than anything else in Cuba.

CIGARS - 1. If you go to Havana, definitely vVisit the Cigar factory (located close to the Capitol building) -you'll never see anything like it in your life.

2. Many locals will try and sell you cigars on the pretence that those in the Partages shops (there are several, including one in Havana Airport) are overpriced. Whether they are genuine or not depends on who's selling them, but be warned - they will likely take you to a dodgy house/apartment down a deserted road, and pressurise you to buy (by the box, not individual cigars).

I personally bought my stash from the Partages as I didn't want to take any risks, and frankly didn't trust anyone trying to sell cigars, which are already much cheaper than in the UK.

GUIDEBOOK - Timeout Havana guide was EXCELLENT. couldn't have done without it (maps at the back are of high detail with hotels/bars/restuarants mapped on and well keyed)

If you have any other questions about Varadero/Havana or any general Cuba questions you think I may be able to assist with (given my very recent 2 week holiday) then please send me a PM.

Gracias