BREXIT is a reality in 9 days

[simwells]

BREXIT is a reality in 9 days

Manufacturing currently employs 2.7 million people earning an average of ?32,500 and contributes 11% of GVA. I wouldn't say we make nothing here anymore.

Yes but what we make is more technically involved higher value parts that are rarely bought direct by consumers, it?s a hugely important part of the economy but it?s hard to think of many household brands which still manufacture in the U.K. that?s a whole different problem to Brexit though


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[puff o'wind]

I'd LOVE Boris to say to BMW and VW "of course we want to keep selling your German cars, of course we do. Please join the queue...you're just after Kia and Tata.

[ZomB]

I prefer Japanese cars

[jerryr]

I'd LOVE Boris to say to BMW and VW "of course we want to keep selling your German cars, of course we do. Please join the queue...you're just after Kia and Tata.

Lovely theory, but if you had the choose of an Audi, VW, or BMW over a Tata what would you choose? And the only British British cars out there are Morgan, Cateram and McLaren. Beautiful cars but totally impractical for an everyday car.


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[geoffbot]

We either both help each other or both fuck each other over any attempt to get one up on the other party we both lose which I suspect is the likely outcome


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'there are no winners in trade wars, only losers'

[puff o'wind]

True, for now. But skoda...Toyota..Lexus...would you have chosen one in 1970

Lovely theory, but if you had the choose of an Audi, VW, or BMW over a Tata what would you choose? And the only British British cars out there are Morgan, Cateram and McLaren. Beautiful cars but totally impractical for an everyday car.


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[pigpen]

I think that shows lack of understanding of what the EU is at its core. Absolutely it is a trading block, but it is so much more. The EU will not and cannot allow a third party (as we will be) to enjoy the same level of access as a member state. We do half our trade with them I would hazard a guess that we do not represent half of their trade.Sure there will be economic pain on both sides, I think that they will be well aware of that. The negotiations on the trade deal will be tough and we have not been doing them on our own for some time now and we shouldn't forget that the EU are very very good at them, a fact even Ian Duncan Smith acknowledged the other day. Aside from the trading aspect we 'lose' so much more. If you speak to anyone involved in medical research for example, we go from being a key player in this sector to overnight to being relegated to a bit part player and the impact that has on our university sector is massive. Top professors will no longer be able to apply for the same level of funding for their research projects, they won't come to the UK to work, the university will lose millions of ???'s as well as repetitional damage, consequently overseas students who help fund our universities, stop coming in the numbers that they were. Then there is access to the results of that medical research, we no longer have the access to that as easily and cheaply as we currently do. I hope I am wrong and we thrive as a country outside the EU I just don't swallow the idea that its going to be a walk in the park. People will still buy those Audi's and BMW's, they will probably have to pay more that's all, kinda like cigars really (except there will not be a 24:24 to ease that pain). This is probably not the forum to have this conversation and I apologise if I have broken any rules or upset any other posters (neither was my aim).

That is one of the more powerful negotiation tools the government has. Now that Parliament can?t cry unfair and we won?t allow it. A lot of people don?t realise Europe need the UK as much if not more than the UK needs Europe as a trading partner. I recon the only difference in the relationship will be boarder entry.




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[Simon Bolivar]

Well I guess I am on the front line of any changes, living in Belgium & working & paying my taxes in the UK. I lost the right to vote yrs ago (you can only do it for 20yrs after leaving the country, great if you retire to Spain at 65yo) but as I still pay my taxes here I believe I should be able to vote.

However, I already have to pay some tax in Belgium directly ( the case used to be, you only paid in one EU country) & they add my salary to my wife's & tax her at the higher joint band so I have also paid indriectly mor etax for 28yrs.

What will change for us? Well lots of little things probably. If were were to leave unexpectedly without any deal next week, we couldn't bring the cat over for our daughter to look after, whilst we are cruising. That's because the instead of just proving she had had the Rabies vaccine (the cat not the wife), we would need to wait 4months & take another blood test; even though of course the threat of Rabies in Belgium won't have risen.

[peanutpete]

what British people seem to forget over Brexit is that we make our self's second class citizens in our own country, straight away EU citizens living here will have more rights then uk citizens (who voted for that??) I believe we will not be able to complete a full trade deal with the Eu in the next 11 months so looks likely we will have to trade for a few years under WTO terms, which as every country knows is the very worst of all worlds, all for some supposed benefit that no one can quantify.and if the EU need us ore ten we need them as some still believe then I would not want to play poker against them

[PeeJay]

True, for now. But skoda...Toyota..Lexus...would you have chosen one in 1970

Nope, first Lexus came out in 1983

[jerryr]

I think that shows lack of understanding of what the EU is at its core. Absolutely it is a trading block, but it is so much more. The EU will not and cannot allow a third party (as we will be) to enjoy the same level of access as a member state. We do half our trade with them I would hazard a guess that we do not represent half of their trade.Sure there will be economic pain on both sides, I think that they will be well aware of that. The negotiations on the trade deal will be tough and we have not been doing them on our own for some time now and we shouldn't forget that the EU are very very good at them, a fact even Ian Duncan Smith acknowledged the other day. Aside from the trading aspect we 'lose' so much more. If you speak to anyone involved in medical research for example, we go from being a key player in this sector to overnight to being relegated to a bit part player and the impact that has on our university sector is massive. Top professors will no longer be able to apply for the same level of funding for their research projects, they won't come to the UK to work, the university will lose millions of ???'s as well as repetitional damage, consequently overseas students who help fund our universities, stop coming in the numbers that they were. Then there is access to the results of that medical research, we no longer have the access to that as easily and cheaply as we currently do. I hope I am wrong and we thrive as a country outside the EU I just don't swallow the idea that its going to be a walk in the park. People will still buy those Audi's and BMW's, they will probably have to pay more that's all, kinda like cigars really (except there will not be a 24:24 to ease that pain). This is probably not the forum to have this conversation and I apologise if I have broken any rules or upset any other posters (neither was my aim).

I think I have quite a comprehensive understanding of what Brexit is. In a way I am fortunate as I have duel citizenship English/German, but I always use my British passport - the country I was born it and educated me. If I speak to Germans I know, a lot of them want out as do the Dutch. EEC was a brilliant idea, but I feel they have overstepped the boundary and are looking to found the European Federation which would be a lovely utopian idea. But is doomed to failure, as is any forced federation of people?s who have different national goals and aspirations. You don?t need to look to far afield. Yugoslavia and the USSR are prime examples, the fact they communist leadership is one reason they failed but the bigger reason is they tried to lump different peoples under one rule is in my opinion the major reason the whole experiment failed. Unfortunately if the EU continue down the same route the same will happen in Europe, and I hope it?s a peaceful brake up.


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[Hookmaker]

BREXIT is a reality in 9 days

I think I have quite a comprehensive understanding of what Brexit is. In a way I am fortunate as I have duel citizenship English/German, but I always use my British passport - the country I was born it and educated me. If I speak to Germans I know, a lot of them want out as do the Dutch. EEC was a brilliant idea, but I feel they have overstepped the boundary and are looking to found the European Federation which would be a lovely utopian idea. But is doomed to failure, as is any forced federation of people?s who have different national goals and aspirations. You don?t need to look to far afield. Yugoslavia and the USSR are prime examples, the fact they communist leadership is one reason they failed but the bigger reason is they tried to lump different peoples under one rule is in my opinion the major reason the whole experiment failed. Unfortunately if the EU continue down the same route the same will happen in Europe, and I hope it?s a peaceful brake up.


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Unfortunately I don?t agree with you Jerry. You?re right - many want out, but the overwhelming majorities of the core country citizens want in. There are a LOT more advantages than disadvantages.
In my mind and the most important for me is that although many member populations might be different the idea of stabilisation of Europe (even by forced political intervention if necessary) is key.
Also, in our world and in the world of tomorrow, there will be no place at the table for little players. The US, China, Russia and India will be big tomorrow, no European country will sit at that table tomorrow - but a united Europe will. And sorry to say, I think the UKs importance will fade out and there won?t be a seat left.

[pigpen]

I was not questioning your understanding of brexit , just what the EU is willing to give ground on. I think we have a difference of opinion on the amount of leverage the UK government has and what the EU will give ground on and this is perhaps not the forum to have this discourse. I doubt either of us are open to being convinced of each others arguments and only time will tell as to the merits of the course of action we are now embarked upon.

I think I have quite a comprehensive understanding of what Brexit is. In a way I am fortunate as I have duel citizenship English/German, but I always use my British passport - the country I was born it and educated me. If I speak to Germans I know, a lot of them want out as do the Dutch. EEC was a brilliant idea, but I feel they have overstepped the boundary and are looking to found the European Federation which would be a lovely utopian idea. But is doomed to failure, as is any forced federation of people’s who have different national goals and aspirations. You don’t need to look to far afield. Yugoslavia and the USSR are prime examples, the fact they communist leadership is one reason they failed but the bigger reason is they tried to lump different peoples under one rule is in my opinion the major reason the whole experiment failed. Unfortunately if the EU continue down the same route the same will happen in Europe, and I hope it’s a peaceful brake up.


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[jerryr]

I was not questioning your understanding of brexit , just what the EU is willing to give ground on. I think we have a difference of opinion on the amount of leverage the UK government has and what the EU will give ground on and this is perhaps not the forum to have this discourse. I doubt either of us are open to being convinced of each others arguments and only time will tell as to the merits of the course of action we are now embarked upon.

Yes we can agree that only time will tell


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[geoffbot]

I do find it amusing that people managed to not only vote (I couldn't possibly decide so didn't), but defend their positions with vigor and criticise others with vitriol! No one, not even the economists with years of geopolitical experience, has any idea what's going to happen so what makes you think you do?! We shall just have to see.